Dialed Podcast 353 - Health concerns cyclists face in 2025

We discuss 10 health concerns cyclists face in 2025, cover some cycling news, and we answer some great EPO Chainmail questions.  Enjoy the podcast!

Fit, Healthy & Happy Podcast
Welcome to the Fit, Healthy and Happy Podcast hosted by Josh and Kyle from Colossus...

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Chapters

• 1:08 Intro
• 2:20 Backpedal
• 13:42 Leadout News
• 18:42 EPO Chainmail
• 23:55 [Ad] Fit, Healthy & Happy Podcast
• 24:42 (Cont.) EPO Chainmail
• 33:17 Health concerns cyclists face in 2025
• 1:13:52 One Last Thing...

Transcript

Jake: [00:00:00] Hi and welcome back to the Dial Up 

Lance: Podcast. I'm Jake Vondringham, here with Lance Friggen Hepler. Lance Friggen Hepler. Welcome to the show. What's up, you 

Jake: frigginess? Hello, friggers. Per usual to his right, Sir Ian Gibson. 

Ian: What's up, ladies and gentlemen on the internet? You guys looking great. Oh, wait. That's not mine.

Jake: What's up, you bloody wanker? Um, You guys, we're missing somebody today. We're missing somebody. 

Ian: That's why I stole his intro. 

Jake: Matt is, well, it was, it was kind of like a, you know, crazy week, if you will. It was New Year's and all that other fun stuff and everybody's all over the place and coordinating schedules just didn't work out.

Jake: And so we landed on Saturday. So we are recording on a Saturday. And then Matt's like, um, I got swim meets to go to. 

Lance: So you've got active involved kids that are in the middle of their swim season. So we don't have Matt today, which kind of sucks. What's up ladies and gentlemen of the internet. You guys are looking good, [00:01:00] particularly good looking good today.

Lance: I mean, 

Jake: I don't know. You guys seem to look good every week. Thanks, Matt. Thank you, Matt. That was nice. Matt is here. I don't know. Cool. All right. Let's uh, let's do some back pedaling. You boys look a little disheveled. You guys got some stories to tell? You guys want to talk 

Ian: about what just happened? We just had the worst ride ever.

Ian: Like 

Lance: It was pretty freaking miserable. 

Ian: No, it was really miserable. Um, but There was no, nobody fell off the bikes and nobody had a mechanical issue. So, which is a good thing because otherwise we did three and a half 

Lance: hours and it rained for three hours and 28 minutes of that. It rained the whole time. I think the high was like 42 degrees.

Lance: So 40 and raining for three and a half hours. It was 

Ian: the Pacific Northwest in its glorious best. Yeah. 

Jake: There were. Four of you? Four of you? [00:02:00] How many of you had fenders? 

Lance: Um, three, 

Ian: three and a half of us. Yeah. 

Lance: Everybody had a full fender on except me. I had a selfish fender on just more or less an ass saver.

Lance: Oh yeah. But everybody else had full fender on. Which 

Ian: was kind of bad because Lance actually was the strongest out there so, and, and yeah, I was on the front. Couldn't really get on his wheel because you get a. Mouth full of road grit. You had, 

Lance: you had so much road grit on your face, Ian, at the end. And your face is probably numb, so you couldn't feel it.

Lance: I wanted to take a picture of it so bad. It was, it made me laugh. 

Ian: You know, when you're picking grit out of your teeth after a ride. 

Lance: It was pretty miserable. 

Ian: I was telling Lance the story of the Scottish mountaineers that only go up when the weather is really bad because everything else is kind of cheating, so it's like, it's either full conditions or it's just not worth doing.

Ian: And that was the ride today, it was full [00:03:00] conditions. Legit. A dinkum ride, as the Aussies might say. Okay. Yeah. Cool. 

Lance: What else? What else you got? What else did you do this week, Ian? 

Ian: I wrote on Swift. Yeah. Did that. Mmm, not much. Um, um, yeah, that's it, really. Cool. How about you, App? 

Lance: Um, I had another big week. I did complete the Rafa Festive 500, although I didn't do 500 kilometers, I did 500 miles.

Lance: Seriously? I did. Wow. Because like half the rides were on Zwift. And so when I got close to like 500 miles, I thought, okay, I'm just going to finish this off and do a full 500 miles instead of just 500 kilometers. That's 

Jake: still impressive. So way to overcome that whole, uh, Stigma of like, you did the Festa 500 on, uh, Zwift?

Jake: On Zwift. Yeah, right. 

Lance: Well, half of it was on Zwift and the other half was outdoors. I did, I did quite a bit outdoors, but, uh, yeah, so I [00:04:00] did a lot. Chapeau. Yeah. Thank you. It was, it was like 23 hours of writing during that, like, eight days or something. Good Lord. And then, uh, New Year's Eve. I went and did a gravel ride, uh, with, uh, three or four teammates out in the, uh, West Hills of Oregon, uh, near North Plains and Hillsboro.

Lance: I think I heard that might've involved a little bit of like snow or something. It didn't rain on us or snow on us, but But it was on the ground, right? But there At the top of every climb, there was snow on the ground. So we rode through quite a bit of snow. But it was only a dusting of snow, but it was cold because of it.

Lance: So, uh, I mean, I had full winter gear on and still my feet were freezing by the end and still my hands didn't work by the end. And it was, you know, roughly perfect. Three and a half hours or something like that that we were out there so that was character building you would have thought that I wouldn't have signed up for it again, but Frickin Ian and I just rolled up and [00:05:00] did it again this morning.

Lance: Although today's ride wasn't As cold it as the one on so yeah, I did a lot of writing. I'm still doing a lot of writing. I'm kind of I'm trying to start this like Daily training vlog. I'm gonna kind of throw that out there for a while. Really? We're gonna post it I'm gonna post it on YouTube. Okay, so just gonna try to do four or five minutes Every day of what I'm training and what my plan is and try to catch a little bit.

Lance: I'm doing it mostly just with my iPhone. Cause I've always got my iPhone with me. And, uh, so the quality won't be that great. It'll be a little bit crappy, but I'm going to try to put something up on YouTube every day or every day that I train, I don't know, which is every day, which is, this is like day, like 20 in a row taken off.

Jake: What's 

Lance: your YouTube handle? It's Lance 

Jake: Hepler. I, I don't. Just youtube. com for slash [00:06:00] Lance Hepler? Yeah, it's just, it's just my name. 

Ian: Parenthesis, freaking close parenthesis. 

Jake: Is it a new channel you started? It's not a new channel, I'm just gonna, I'm just gonna roll. There's some old Lance crap on there. Might be worth checking out, huh?

Jake: Yeah, 

Lance: if you go look, it's, some of it's a little scary, but. Sweet. So I'm gonna, I'm gonna see how that goes. I'm gonna try to do a little, little something every day and. And if you're into rock counting, you can find Lance on Tik Tok. Yep. They'll probably end up being some rock counting on, on these daily vlogs too.

Lance: We'll just have to see what happens. So that's it. Cool. Jake. 

Jake: I started riding again. It's been a minute, but I started riding again. I rode on, gosh, what was it? I was on the bike on the 29th, I think it was. Yeah. So that was my first ride back and the doctor said, just go slow, go easy. You know, 15, 20 minutes should be fine.

Jake: So I rode for 45, um, of course, and, but all things considered though, I didn't feel bad. It was a little, [00:07:00] I don't know, it wasn't super comfortable. It wasn't uncomfortable. So it was just, I don't know, it was just not perfect, but it was like good enough to go for rides. So that was good. Took the next day off.

Jake: Cause I didn't think it was a good idea to go back to back days. So I rode on, um, New Year's Eve, and I ended up getting, like, fully engrossed in some YouTube thing that I was watching, and I think I already told you this, and I'm like, alright, I'm gonna try and ride for maybe 45 minutes again, and I remember looking down at the iPad that I had pushed off to the side, it was in the other direction that I was looking when I was watching the TV, and I looked over there, and I was like, over an hour, and I'm like, holy crap, and I usually am, like, dreading every last, like, minute that you're on there, like, You know, you're watching every second tick off.

Jake: Right. And I was again, fully engrossed in this thing. I looked over, it was like over an hour and I ended up riding for like an hour and 10, around 15 minutes, felt pretty good. And I was riding at a pretty solid zone to ride for me, at least, and, um, felt good. Came back on new year's day and Mike, right.

Jake: Well, the guys are starting up the dialed 100, which is all right. They're going to ride every single day [00:08:00] for at least an hour. You can ride it on the trainer. That's fine. But you get to ride for at least an hour for a hundred days. We know what happened last time I did that. 501 days later, finally hung them up.

Jake: But, um, so I did that, that however, like 45 minutes into it and I wasn't writing that hard, both of my quads cramped, like mad crazy. I was like, all right, this isn't good, but I've got to get at least, How long has it been, you've been off? How long were you off the bike? Like six weeks? Uh, it was, I think I was fully off the bike for about five weeks.

Jake: Okay. So, not that long, but it was, I kind of tapered down because of the issues that I was having was like keeping me from riding the way that I wanted to. So I just kind of, you know. Anyway, long story short, I got these massive cramps, man. I have been so freaking sore from these things, I can't even get back on the bike right now.

Jake: But I'm going to try and do a little spin this evening just to see if I can kind of loosen them up a little bit. But, um, I don't care about the cramps. I'm just happy that I was able to ride a bike again and it just kind of put me in my happy spot. So [00:09:00] look out world. Here we come. Yeah. We're waiting for it.

Jake: And not for nothing. I mean, I'm ahead of schedule. I mean, originally I wasn't going to be able to ride until like. mid to end of January. So the fact of the matter is I'm back on the bike. I'm ahead of the schedule. I feel good. All of my other symptoms have completely gone away. So I don't have any issues.

Jake: It's just, you know, mildly uncomfortable to ride, but that's going to go away eventually. These cramps will sort themselves out and hopefully, uh, by the month, I'll be kind of back out there cranking. So 

Lance: fantastic, 

Jake: but you will not find me riding on a day like today with you jack holes that went out there and yeah.

Lance: Okay. What? Once you're an hour in, just don't stop. We just, we just could not stop. We kept, like, regrouping a little bit, and I'm like, I'm not stopping anywhere. If we stop too long, this ride is over. It's 

Jake: so funny that you mention that because I knew what time you guys were doing the whole thing, and it's funny, this morning my wife asked me if I wanted to go for a walk.

Jake: I'm like, yeah, I'll do that. They'll just kind of be fun to go up and walk the dogs. And it was like, yeah. I don't know, four miles or something like that to this little coffee shop and went and got a coffee and walking back. I'm like, [00:10:00] Oh, we're going to miss him by like 20 minutes or so. Cause we were walking back from where you guys were grouping and we didn't want to wait because we saw that there was rain coming in the forecast.

Jake: You would have seen 

Lance: us roll right by. So we were way late by the way. 

Jake: Well, yeah. And then I get home and as I told you, I went and I looked finally, I'm like, Oh, I wonder where that in the ride. Thinking that you guys can be way into it at this point, you guys have maybe gone two miles. It's like 11 o'clock and it's like an hour after you guys were supposed to have started.

Jake: And at that same time, the reason why I looked is because it started pouring outside. I'm like, geez, I hope they're pretty far. And I wonder how far up they are and not very far. And then I'm thinking to myself, maybe I should go like run some coffee and hot chocolate out to Oh, they're probably not gonna want to stop and da da da.

Jake: I don't know, just we did not stop. It was, I mean, it was 

Ian: not, um, I was not cold. Were you cold? It was, it was just, my gloves were absolutely full of water. My shoes are full of water. It's just hands and toes cold. No, it 

Lance: wasn't cold either. Just it's just miserable. Just waterlogged. Yeah. Yeah. The 

Ian: very [00:11:00] best part of the ride is, was finishing up with in the hot tub at Lance's and the sauna.

Ian: So Yes, 

Lance: we did a round of hot tub and sauna at my house and that was quite nice. I've 

Ian: absolutely discovered Lance's secret to his performance success and he's been cheating the whole time. I'm like, this is this unfair advantage. Like I got out of the sauna, I'm like, I could do that loop again. 

Lance: It feel pretty good 20 minutes.

Lance: Honestly, 

Jake: how often do you use the sauna? Like, like three days or four days a week. Do you do that in the summer too? Yeah. 

Lance: Yes. Yeah. Wow. CETA. So the, the, the, the heat acclimation is one of those things that increases your blood plasma volume. Exactly. And so you end up increasing your endurance ability by doing regular sauna and heat work.

Lance: And so, um, it's much more enjoyable during the winter. Did he show you his little EPO stash that he keeps in there too? I wish, [00:12:00] but. Uh, the, the heat acclimation really does help quite a bit, but, um, it's one of those things where you lose it quickly. So like, if you don't do it for like seven or 10 days, it's gone.

Lance: The plasma volume that you've built up, it goes away pretty quickly. So that's a good thing about. heat acclimation is you can build it up fairly quickly, but you lose it pretty quickly. Sure. 

Ian: It's all, it's all out of my budget, but I told him I'm going to one up him with an altitude tent. Because sleeping in an altitude tent, you're going 

Lance: to make your wife sleep in the other bedroom and you're going to sleep in the altitude tent.

Jake: Yeah. All right. Well. Moving on. Champ 

Lance: Bailey, horse champ. Here. 

Jake: What up? Champ? 

Lance: Champ. Champ is here. Your face 

Jake: into a car with you. Wait, hold on. Oh, hold on. And take your mother, Dorothy, man. Two out for a nice seafood dinner and never call her again. That's right. Champ. Champ 

Lance: out. No Champ is here. It has been all [00:13:00] cyclocross all week.

Lance: The, uh, Christmas period is. pretty much over, but it rolled kind of through today. Matthew Vanderpool went five for five in the races that he did. He won every single race he lined up for. Uh, in the last race he did Lohenhout. Um, he did end up crashing on his last lap. I don't know if you saw, I guess I just showed you guys the little clip of it.

Lance: But, he was on the last lap, coming around the corner, just kind of slipped out a little bit, and, and hit a wooden stake, and snapped the wooden stake off. And apparently he injured his ribs during that time. So he has bailed on the next, to races that he had scheduled to do. Which is kind of a huge blow for the race organizers.

Lance: And for him, actually, personally, those guys get, like, 50, 000 euros appearance fee. Well, Vanderpool does. Just to show up. Just to show up. And then, what does he get if he wins the race? Uh, there's just whatever prize money there is. But they [00:14:00] have, like, Show up money. Yeah, was it 

Ian: was he even gunning for the top spot in that series?

Ian: No, he doesn't care about the series at all He's gonna race a championship. He just wants 

Lance: to win the world championships again. That would tie him with seven Victories for one of the greatest cyclocrossers of all time some Belgian. I can't remember his name. I should know that It's not Sven Nys. Yeah. So anyway, uh, so Vanderpool, uh, has skipped a couple of races in his absence.

Lance: Uh, Elie Easterbit won at GP Sven Nys. Lawrence Sveak has won a couple of races, including Cox's Day, which is the greatest city name I've ever heard in my entire life. And, and, um, Today was a super prestige race and Wout van Aert showed up. Um, Vanderpool wasn't there, Wout van Aert was there, all the other regulars were there.

Lance: Um, he ended up battling with, [00:15:00] he was not off the front like, like Vanderpool normally is. Yeah. But he ended up battling with a bunch of guys. He battled with, uh, Van Tauernheid. He battled with Elie Easterbit. Him and Easterbit kind of ended up getting away with a couple laps to go. Um, but Easterbit muffed one little corner and, and Wout van Aert didn't.

Lance: And so Wout ended up winning the race today. Okay. Yeah. So that was kind of exciting. Well, it's only doing a couple more races. He's just doing it for just because he likes it. Just for fun. He probably gets appearance money as well. He doesn't get 50 grand like Vanderpool does, but man, the crowds, when those guys show up, it, it's crazy.

Lance: The crowd, yeah, it just, they were like, they're like eight people deep, like all the way around the course. You watch these races, it's amazing how many people are there and how Those guys are cycling gods in that sport, yeah. Standing in the mud 

Ian: drinking beer. Yes, 

Lance: yes, so that was all pretty exciting. So, another crazy thing happened, uh, I think it was today, um, [00:16:00] Lars Vanderhaar again fell and dislocated his shoulder.

Lance: Oh. Oh. And jumped up, and put his arm on the bike, popped his shoulder back in, jumped on, and finished the race. Like you do. My freaking, good, I, what, what is that guy made out of? I don't understand how you can do that. Anyway, kudos, Lars Vandahar. That's pretty incredible. Uh, I don't know what else happened.

Lance: What else happened? Um, Puck, Peter Ace, uh, or Peter's, or I don't know how to say it. She's also Puck. Yeah. Puck. 

Jake: Yeah. 

Lance: Just call her Puck. Everybody knows what you're talking about. She's been battling with Lucinda Brand and, uh, uh, Carmen Alvarado and, uh, Van Empel, but she won Coccidae. Um, I think Lucinda Brand won today at the Super Prestige Gullegim.

Lance: Um, so, it's been a bunch of [00:17:00] fun races. That's it! Cyclocross. 

Ian: Cyclocross? We're coming up on, um, Tour Down Under, is that right? Pretty soon, I think, right? Yeah, that's usually like, 

Jake: late, mid late. January, if I'm not mistaken. Yeah. Yeah. It's kind of like the official kickoff of the season. A lot of big names go to that, but, um, it's, it's a race nevertheless.

Jake: Yeah. 

Lance: Yeah. 

Jake: I'm looking for it. Yep. January 16th. There you go. 

Lance: Yeah. So that's crazy. In a couple of weeks, 

Jake: yeah. Mike Grayson's back. Love it, baby. That's cool. All right. Champ out. Thank you champ. 

Lance: Yep. 

Jake: Appreciate it. Ow. Hey, uh, EPO Chainmail. EPO 

Lance: Chainmail. Did we get some messages? 

Jake: We did. Got a few messages and, um, it won't be here this week, but next week, I'm, I'm hoping got a new little intro, little jingle for this.

Jake: Oh, cool. Working on something. I got a few things going, but, um, all right. The first one comes to us from a listener out of Salem, Oregon, and, um, it was more of like a, an episode idea or [00:18:00] like a, you know, like a topic for us to discuss. And, and I definitely think it's something that we can dig deep into.

Jake: into, but let me ask the question that he puts out there. Um, I'll just read it as it said, uh, tire suggestion for upcoming gravel races. I'm going to be doing some of the mud slinger and zone five events, um, in quotes, uh, gorge gravel, real West cascade gravel, and he tried the path finder pro 38 and the rhombus pro last year.

Jake: And neither were the quote unquote one for him. Um, the road, the Rama city was running were the 42s and he basically wants to know. What are your tire suggestions? What do you, what do you boys run in these days in a race? And what would you suggest for some of these, um, Pacific Northwest races? Maybe as like a good all arounder, cause we know Lance is probably going to have tires based on what the race is, but not everybody has that, that luxury.

Jake: What's a good all arounder that you would recommend to folks? 

Lance: I, I, I gotta say, I really do like the. Boken double cross the IRC Boken double cross tires. Um, [00:19:00] I, man, I'm struggling with my tire selection as well lately, because I keep, you keep hearing that bigger is better and it's just as fast and it's, it's, it's easier on you and it's less flat, you know, you know, It it's more whatever.

Lance: So I, I keep trying to think that bigger tires are going to be better. I'm currently riding 47s. I have 47s on my bike and I have the specialized Pathfinder pros on at the moment. Yeah. Um, but, and they're very fast running. They're a very popular tire for smooth conditions. Gorge gravel grinder, pretty smooth conditions.

Lance: Um, real West gravel. 

Ian: I don't. 

Lance: Yeah. 

Ian: There's just one chunky part in the, in the longer ride, in the longer, in the 60 miler, there's a 

Lance: It's going to be different this year, a little bit different course this year. 

Ian: Really? 

Lance: Um, yeah, a technical, I hope. Not as technical, I think. I think they're taking out the There was [00:20:00] a technical ish downhill that crossed railroad tracks, and I think they're taking it out because the train went through a couple times and held people up.

Lance: So they're, they're changing the course a 

Ian: little bit. Other than that, sort of two mile, relatively chunky section, everything else was pretty smooth on Pendleton. So those, those early, early gravel races, yeah, I mean, just, uh, you don't need to have an aggressive tyre. 

Lance: But Gorge Gravel Grinder, um, that course is pretty smooth.

Lance: There is one or two ugly sections on it. That are only a mile or two long, and that's where everybody crashes, and that's where everybody has, like, flat issues around those short sections. You can actually go around it, but there's a time penalty to go around it. Like, it, it's like an extra half mile longer or something like that.

Lance: But, um, Gorge Gravel was pretty buffed out. Um, I'm not answering this very well because I'm not sure what to do. But, [00:21:00] the Bokken double cross, Tires that are, I I've raced them in 38 and I've raced them in 42 and they roll fast on the smooth stuff and pavement. And they have decent side knob where you can, you can trust them in the corners.

Lance: So those have treated me really well, but I've raced them so many times that. I'm wanting to try other things. So these, these specialized pathfinder pros actually have better rolling resistance and they go faster. So I'm trying those, but I got 47, the biggest ones they make. And now I kind of wish I only had like 38 because I'm going to pick those and use those on courses that aren't quite as chunky or nasty, where I'm just going to roll better.

Jake: How about this? I mean, It's, I don't know, that's just one of those topics that everybody's constantly comparing and contrasting and everybody's going to have like varying opinions on what works best. I mean, for me personally, I really need something that's going to be reliable and it's going to be [00:22:00] puncture resistant because the last thing you wanted to be doing is.

Jake: Working on, you know, plugging the tire or, you know, putting a tube in or doing something. All your gains are gone as soon as you flat. Exactly. So all of that stuff is just out the window. It's like, who cares about all this stuff? It's gotta be something that's gonna, you know, hold up and it's gonna, you know, if you know the route and you know that it's completely buffed up, then yeah, fine, be a little bit more aggressive.

Jake: But. It's not gravel racing, right? For, for most parts, that's not what you're going to see. So I need something that's reliable and I have tinkered with different things and it does need to be fast. I don't want to have big, massive knobby tires on there. That's going to slow you down. It does need to be able to grab in the corners and all that stuff.

Jake: And I've only tried like a few me personally, and I have opinions on those, but I need to try more. So my question to you is, is like ramble off the ones that you've run and the ones that you've used and the one, and what's your thoughts on them might be? 

Lance: Um, I've used Maxis ramblers. I've raced those quite a few times and I've had great luck and success with those.

Lance: Those are very good tires. They just don't, they don't quite have the rolling resistance to some of the other tires, but, um, I've had really good [00:23:00] luck with those. I've used a gravel King. Um, I pan eraser, yes, pan erasers, gravel king, um, and those have a little bit more grip and a very tight pattern right on the, on the center channel.

Lance: So they roll pretty well on the flat stuff. It's like a 

Jake: file tread, almost kind of a thing. Yeah, yeah, 

Lance: but they still have decent grip on the sides. Um, I've rolled. I even tried some mountain bike tires. I've tried to put like Maxis Aspens on my gravel bike. They don't quite fit. So they only made it one ride and I had to take them off.

Lance: So, uh, my, my, my, uh, my bike will only take up to a 50 millimeter tire. And those were like, 2. 25, which is actually like 55 millimetres. So they didn't quite fit. Um, those are kind of the main ones that I've gone with. Gotcha. How about you Ian? Have you tinkered with yours much? No, I 

Ian: really haven't. Actually the tires on my gravel bike are the tires that came [00:24:00] on my gravel bike, but they're, they're 40 millimetre, which I think is just right in the sweet spot.

Ian: At least around here for the kind of courses I've been doing, which is Relatively, um, smooth gravel. Sure. Um, we did have some, um, teammates last year that, that, Kind of took it a little too, too far. I think, and went with a narrower tire thinking that that that's what we needed for the, um, better rolling resistance and just the volume of air in those times were just not enough to give you enough, um, puncture protection.

Ian: So, um, Yeah, just 

Jake: the footprint that you get to on those. I mean, you're going to have to run a little bit higher tire pressure. So you're, you're just, you're dealing with like a narrower tire with a smaller footprint, just based on the fact that you've got, you know, less contact areas. So I think that that kind of is a little bit of a disadvantage in some scenarios.

Jake: I mean, I'm sure that there's some like really. hard packed, you know, just, it's not even really gravel. It's like a hard dirt road. Yes. That's going to be [00:25:00] great. But that's, that's not the essence of gravel. And that's what a lot of gravel races and gravel riding are not. So. 

Ian: And again, that, that having a decent volume of air in the tires is.

Ian: Kind of the best puncture protection, even on those super smooth, uh, gravel roads, you come across some sharp rocks and some heavy hits every now and again. So to me, it comes more down to tire width choice and, and of course, pressure. And that's, that's 

Jake: the pressure is a big one. This is a big thing. Yeah.

Jake: I've been a real big fan of anything from pretty much 40 to 45. I've had really good success with those. I can make them go fast. They descend well, they hook up well. I can get the right tire pressures for myself. So you get a little bit of compliance and hooks up nicely. Um, I've run the, let's see here, the continental Terra speeds.

Jake: Um, I actually really quite like those. And I, I, I wasn't expecting to, but they did really well. And I was expecting them because they've got these just like little, I don't know, rounded knobs all over the place on them. And I, but they still hooked up well in the corners. They rolled really quickly [00:26:00] and I was expecting them because I started running them at the beginning of the summer and I put quite a few miles on them and they were worn down pretty good.

Jake: We get to the fall, starts to rain. We've got leaves all fricking mess. They still hooked up really well. I'm like, All right, something's going on here, some witchcraft going on with these tires, but, um, I wanted to try other things, um, so I haven't put those back on yet, but I did run the, let's see, the Sentrato from Pirelli.

Jake: Don't like those. Um, there were, and I think that might even be what came on your bike. Maybe Ian, I'm not a hundred percent sure, but anyway, the, my biggest gripe with those is they weren't necessarily bad, but if you're on like a harder surface, you want the way that they would hook up and you'd start getting into the turns, especially if you're riding on the road, it's You felt like you're on a rail, like it was going to either take you off into the bushes or, you know, like fold into the, the, the, the turn there.

Jake: And then if you're running too low of a pressure, um, for offer, that was, it was just one of those things where you couldn't write it on the road because it just felt like a bloody mess. And then if you're writing too hard to kind of compensate for the harder stuff and you get off road, then it's just too hard [00:27:00] and you're sliding out everywhere.

Jake: And I could just never find like harmony with those. And I just, ah, just didn't care for them. So moved on from those. And then I've run the. Maxis ramblers. I've done a lot of miles on those really good results. Didn't, didn't, um, didn't have any issues with them and you know, they're not the fastest rolling tire out there, but they were reliable and dependable for me.

Jake: So, and I think the other one was the, it's the Maxis renegade baby. That's another one. Yep. I've done a few rides on those as well. And I think if, if I did, you know, just pick one from all of those in terms of performance, I think the, the continental Tara speed was probably the best performing tire, but the best all around tire for me was going to be the rambler.

Jake: That's just my two cents. That's not a big sample size of tires to choose from. So that, that is on my agenda of things to do this year is like, all right, let's have a few wheels set up with different tires and let's start testing these things and really put them through the paces and see what they're all about.

Jake: Yep. So anyway, that's a, that was a good question. 

Lance: That's a good question. 

Jake: Appreciate that. And then one other quick one. Um, this one's kind of fun too. It's, [00:28:00] uh, We don't need to spend a ton of time on it, but the, the listener asks, what is everyone's favorite and least favorite team kits from the pro Peloton, if you will, um, his personal favorite was the EF education 2022 kit from tour de France with the pinks and splashes, the blues and neon yellow highlights.

Jake: Um, He said it was insane, but very memorable. And then let's see here. The SD, uh, SD works has a very similar, bright and exciting design style. Then his favorite, um, that's his favorite current kit. And then his least favorite, you guys want to guess what his least favorite kit is from the pro Peloton UAE black and white?

Jake: No, no. Ian, you got any guesses on this? AG2R. AG2R. I don't know. Yeah, the brown pants. Brown shorts. Was that the same team? And it was a few years ago. We talked about this. They had the, um, the jorts. The, the, the denim colored, um. Denim colored. Yeah. That was kind of crazy. I think that was AG2R that did that as well, but [00:29:00] that was, that was pretty bad.

Jake: But do you guys have a favorite kit? Like maybe all time or 

Lance: current or what have you? I'm really. I'm, I'm really disappointed that no pro teams have orange kits. Well, does anybody have orange kids? 

Jake: The, the, the BMC team, when they got bought out, gosh, was it the CCC? I think it was that took over that. I think there was like a clothing or shoe company or something.

Jake: I can't remember. But when they took that over, they had orange kits. And they were only around for, I don't know, like a year or two and that, that team folded and I don't know why or what happened to them, but outside of that, nobody really wears much orange. 

Lance: I'm dialed orange through and through. So I, I, uh, all my bike stuff has some kind of orange somewhere, but I do really like Jayco's new kits.

Lance: They just came out with this year. I think they're purple. Really? Yeah. And that's just a regal, kingly color. It just, I don't know. It spoke to me. I like the purple kits. Yeah, there you go. He's like, 

Jake: wait, wait, am I supposed to say something? I kind of 

Ian: like the new, [00:30:00] um, UAE kit. They're just, Yeah, it's kind of got black sleeves and black highlights, but it's basically, it hasn't changed the whole lot, but I think it's got some class and then, uh, I like the FDJ, uh, group armor kit.

Jake: Did you guys like the, was it the Tinkoff? Remember that when, uh, Sagan first came on, it was the, gosh, the Russian billionaire that owned that team. I think that was his name. Do you remember that? That was kind of like a little bit of a splashy kind of a color kit. I thought that was kind of cool, but it was like one of those, like.

Jake: You don't want that for a long period of time. It was kind of cool for a season. Um, yeah, I can't think of anything off the top of my head that really screams at me as like being awesome. But I, I have to wholeheartedly agree that I think that the uh, the EF Foundations Kit, I, I like that. I like that pink kit.

Jake: But like Lance said, somebody needs some orange out there and purple. 

Ian: It's all about having the right shoes and socks and sunglasses, I reckon. That's all supposed to be white, right? It's gotta be white. An arrow. A failing. Yeah. 

Lance: Everything's [00:31:00] black. Yeah. And orange.

Jake: All right. Yeah. All right, boys. That was fun. We'll, uh, we'll do that again. And for us to do this, what do we need? What do we need people to do? 

Ian: We need people to Oh, ride in. Please send us our send. Send us a text. Yeah, we're really digging these. Appreciate, send us your EPO. 

Jake: Yeah, send us your EPO chain mails.

Jake: Appreciate that. All right, let's jump into our topic for today. Um. This one is something that we kind of curated here with, um, kind of in mind with what's going on, but it's the top 10 health concerns that cyclists face in 2025. Our list starts off with, we doing this because we're all old and broken.

Jake: Probably. Okay. Let's just stuff that we're familiar with. And we know what to talk about. Um, the first one is over use injuries. Guys know anybody that's ever done anything? In the overuse department that's led to an injury? 

Ian: Uh, 

Lance: yeah. Like, yeah. All of 

Jake: us. All of 

Ian: us. Yeah, I've got one going on right now. Yeah.

Ian: My right knee is just, it's just from [00:32:00] all those miles, I think. It's just wearing out. Yeah. 

Jake: I mean, the rub here, the agitation, if you will, is like just repeated stress on knees and hips and lower back from impoper bike fits or excessive training and just, or crashing and just the, and then the long term damage of doing that over and over again.

Jake: Yeah. Yeah. That's the problem. How do you guys fix that? How do you guys, how do you guys get around or circumvent or mitigate? I just had a 

Ian: cortisone shot. That's a very short term solution though. And I, and it's really because I've got so much going on in the next couple of weeks, it's, it's understood that it's probably going to wear off in three or four weeks and it's not fully working right now, but it's definitely an issue.

Ian: Um, I think bike fit is, is one of the, That was the most, the most important thing because you, you're, you're putting your knee through or whatever joint you're talking about is doing this thing over and over and over again. And if it's not, if the alignment's out, something's not right, you're going to.

Jake: Yeah. And it's not [00:33:00] just your knees too. Like if you're holding an improper position because of an improper bike fit, then you're going to start putting undue stress on all the other parts of your body, your neck, your shoulders, your back. 

Ian: I think it's particularly important this time of year when we spending a lot of time on the trainers, where.

Ian: You sit there, you tend to sit there in the same position. You're not getting up out of the saddle. You're not moving around as much. You're not changing your cadence as much. You just, it's very repetitive. And I found with my bike, uh, on the trainer, this, this knee thing seems to have started since I've upped my volume inside.

Jake: And you've got the fit on the trainer. Like you've got a kicker bike, right? Because 

Ian: yes, but I have one of these, uh, noseless. Saddles on my indoor training, which is super comfortable, but at the same time, it makes it a little bit harder to judge, you know, bike to bike exactly where the nose of that saddle should be and where I end up sitting on the seat relative to [00:34:00] my road bike.

Ian: So it's not, it's not, um, that simple just saying, okay, I'm just going to measure my road bike and make sure that my trainer is set up the same way, but it needs to be. And I think cleat position, uh, The insoles in your shoes, you know, all of those things can, can have a bearing on this and getting a decent quality bike fit is definitely a worthwhile investment.

Jake: You know, just one more added layer. And I've had this conversation with quite a few people over the last couple of weeks, because they're asking these questions about that. Because the indoor training stuff, like you've got to be comfortable and it's got to be something that's got to be sustainable, not just for the duration of your ride, but.

Jake: All of the rides that are going to stack up on top of each other for the course of this whole winter. Cause if you're going to do like the, the lion's share of your training on a trainer, you need to have that right. So like Ian said, the fit is going to be huge, but secondary to that is. You can't just sit in that same position and not move at all and not get off the trainer and feel like absolute garbage.

Jake: I mean, [00:35:00] you'll get off in your hips and your low back and your neck and your shoulders, everything just kind of like knotted up. So I highly recommend to people that you make a conscious effort to move around. And one of the things that I really like about the kicker bike or people that are using the kicker climb is the fact that you've got the elevation component.

Jake: So you can either do it in manual mode and just have to take the, or have the mental awareness to like change your position from time to time so that you're kind of going up and down and it just causes your body to articulate a little bit and you move and you're in different positions or you can actually put it into the mode where it's actually following.

Jake: The, um, the ups and downs of what Zwift is doing, which is quite nice. So that you're again, put yourself in a position of like, all right, I'm not in the same position for this entire period of time, which is really good. The other thing is these things have a lot of give if you're using these trainers, um, if you set them up right now, a lot of people have their setups out in the garage.

Jake: I talked to quite a few, I was just having a conversation with a teammate two days or yesterday about this. And a lot of people have their setups in the garage, so they're on a hard concrete [00:36:00] surface. And if they're, they're trainers on that, and then the front wheels on the ground, there's no give on that.

Jake: However, I mean, some of the newer kickers do have those vulcanized rubber little disc feet things. So yeah, tiny bit of, of movement there, but there's different ways that you can make it more comfortable and it doesn't have to be a lot of motion, but people are using things like rocker plates or they're making their own things as well.

Ian: Have you spoken to people that have used these? Rocker plates. Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Do they make a big difference? I'd like to try. 

Jake: Absolutely do. And for me personally, I don't use a rocker plate because I can get enough movement out of my particular setup. I've got a little bit thicker of a carpet and then I've got a thicker rubber mat that's got a little give to it.

Jake: And then the feet of the kicker bike and all that other stuff have give to it. And so the, the, the. The, the feet, you can actually like adjust the, the feet on that up just a tiny bit, just maybe a couple of millimeters, which kind of gives it a little bit of back and forth. And then you have that sitting on top of the rubber mat on top of the carpet.

Jake: And then if you think about that, it's going to move just a little bit down there at the bottom. But as that translates, as it goes up, there's quite a bit of side to side motion that you're going to get, and it's not going to put any undue [00:37:00] stress on the kicker bike itself. Yeah. But again, that natural sway that you get when you're riding a bike, that helps alleviate a lot of things with respect to your back and your neck and your shoulders and so on.

Jake: So it makes it more comfortable and enjoyable. 

Ian: I'm trying to figure out how I'm going to take my kicker bike to the bank fitter. Like 60, 60, probably 60 or 70 pounds. It's more than that. More than that kicker kicker, just 

Jake: a regular kicker weighs 55 pounds. Yeah. That kicker bike probably, yeah, it's about 150 pounds, but I don't know how you're going to get that there.

Jake: Bye. I mean, you can get all the measurements and get a pretty stinking close up. 

Lance: I took all the measurements from my road bike that I feel comfortable on and just translated them to the kicker bike that I ride. And 

Jake: what's really cool about the kicker bike too is you can take your measurements from your road bike, your mountain bike, and your gravel bike.

Jake: And then you can make all the markings on the kicker bike with a pen. And if you want to start like, all right, I need to start getting acclimated to this gravel race. That's going to come up. You can change the geometry away from your road bike to a gravel setup so that you're set up for that. So there's a lot of upsides to the, you [00:38:00] know, the indoor training bikes, like a kicker attacks and so on, but pretty cool stuff.

Jake: Yeah. 

Lance: The kicker bike is infinitely adjustable. Sure. You can change the reach, the stack, the seat height, the stand over height, the, you know, all the things that you can change. You can change your crank length just by moving your pedals. I 

Jake: think from 60, 165 to 175, I think you can change that much. Yes. And what's kind of cool is like, I got it.

Jake: You could probably put somebody on there. That's four 10 and you could put another person on there. That's six foot nine. And it's still going to fit both of those people. That's the beautiful thing about those. So yeah, pretty cool little devices. Um, yeah. So then the other thing that I would recommend too, for the overuse stuff in the end is beat the drum on this one pretty loud is, uh, cross training.

Jake: You got to do some cross training. That's going to help you beat the, the whole, like sitting in this one plane, one dimensional, like riding motion. Like you can start to do other things that are going to compliment the, you know, what your body needs to, you know, if you're [00:39:00] just doing one thing with riding this bike, you're going to work all the antagonist muscle groups to that so that you're going to have balance.

Jake: You want to have balance in your body and instability. So, all right, the next one, the next problem, mental health. Challenges with mental health. 

Lance: Well, your mental health suffers if you're not riding enough. 

Jake: A hundred percent. Is that what they're talking about? Cause 

Lance: that's what I think. How 

Jake: about, um, and, and this is real too.

Jake: Like people get burned out from the competitive pressures of riding bikes and racing, think about like all of the, the calm hunting and then pinning on a number or trying to keep up with, uh, your, your friends and going to all the fast group rides. I mean, it's fun, but But there, there can be a point in time where you just get burned out on that.

Jake: And sometimes that can wear on you mentally. And like, like you feel pressure to have to show up to go to these things. Cause maybe you're on a team and the team's like, and we need you out there. And you're like, I just don't want to race this week and I'm tired. And you still go and you're like, put on your smile and you ultimately are going to have fun, but you get burned out that way.

Jake: So it's a, 

Ian: it's an absolute massive topic, [00:40:00] mental health, health, and the effect it has on your cycling performance, the effect it has on the rest of your life because one of the. One of the big things is you, as a cyclist, you can end up with your whole sort of identity, your whole, um, everything about you, you, you, you can base on your cycling if you're not careful and you have to sort of step back sometimes and go, well, this is just a part of what I do.

Ian: I don't need to. 

Lance: There's also rocks. There's 

Ian: also rocks. Yeah. And go to the gym. You know, and 

Jake: there's also sometimes like just feeling the stress of like, I have to go out and do a three hour ride. Because I got to be able to keep up and some are for our ride in the rain, you know, when it's just miserable and if you have to go do that by yourself and you just really don't want to, but you have to.

Jake: And like, there's just like this pressure on you. Sometimes it's like pressure that you're putting on yourself, but maybe other people are putting it on you. Well, that was 

Lance: fully why we did what we did today. Me and Ian, because we've got a training camp coming up that we don't want to. [00:41:00] suck for. Yeah. So we suffered today for that reason.

Lance: Yep. 

Ian: I think the biggest pressure I put on myself on the bike is like in the last five minutes of a ride when I'm trying to figure out what I'm gonna call it on Strava.

Jake: So just a couple things here is just, you know, focus on balancing everything by mixing social and solo rides, you know, And, and, and when I say social, it doesn't have to be a social breakneck team flogging kind of ride, like go do something fun, you know, with some people maybe purposefully or intensely reach out to some people that, you know, don't ride like that or ride much slower than you and just volunteer to go for a ride with them.

Jake: So you've got that camaraderie and then you can maybe call that your active recovery zone one, low zone two ride. Just don't 

Ian: invite freaking Hedler. Or just let him go. No good at those, can't do it. 

Jake: So, and then, um, you know, just have realistic goals for everything and take breaks and maybe unplug from data driven metrics from time to time.

Lance: [00:42:00] I can stroll Strava for an hour and a half. That's not a good thing sometimes. 

Jake: Does your FTP give you stress or anxiety sometimes? 

Lance: Oh, heck yes. It's too low. It's not big enough. It's not. I can't hang with these people. My FTP is not good. All 

Jake: right. The next one. Let's move on here. Um, saddle sores and saddle issues.

Lance: Okay. I did get a saddle store this last year and it had to do with a improper seat height that it took me two days to figure out that it was actually too slow. And yeah, man, it, it laid me out for like a week or more. So, and I still wasn't done with the rate. It, this was during the Oregon trail gravel grinder.

Lance: So I had a problem with my seat post. I have dropper seat on my, on my gravel bike and I completely destroyed the shims on it. And so. I had to have it serviced, and in the process, it wasn't, it, we didn't put it back at the same height. And it was close enough that I didn't notice, [00:43:00] until the next day, when I'd already ridden another, like, 80 miles on it.

Lance: And the saddle sore, like, cropped up. And I'm like, oh man, this is gonna be bad. So how do you deal with it? Um, salves and creams, and I actually used Moleskin? Donut shaped moleskin. Oofed. And, and, man, that's not in a happy spot to, to apply No. and put it on there properly 

Jake: Mm. 

Lance: and for it to stay there for the entire ride.

Lance: I didn't even want to think about the application process. And that's, that's laying on his back, sped eagle like. With a mirror in my hand. I'm trying to put it in the right spot. Is it gonna stay? Is it gonna stay? So, um, I generally don't use like, like chamois cream unless it's like a five or six hour ride or I know I'm doing multiple days in a row because my undercarriage is generally pretty much Pretty leather, like

Lance: But you know, that's something we 

Jake: kind of take for granted. We do, like a lot of people, a 

Ian: [00:44:00] lands leather under the carriage . 

Jake: A lot of people will come into cycling and they're, they, they see all the rage and everybody's having fun, and it's a great way to do fun things and get fit and whatnot. But the biggest turnoff for the vast majority of people is.

Jake: How uncomfortable it is to sit on the saddle when they first get started and what they need to understand, and what a lot of people need to understand. And even some people that have been in the sport for a little while is like saddles are different for everybody. You need to know the width of your sits bones.

Jake: You need to know what shape best is going to fit your body. You need to know like just your anatomy and like, what's going to fit a guy. Each guy at this table probably is going to wear a different saddle, but then if we're talking about the women too, it's a fully different saddle. So you need to make sure that you're getting the proper saddle and that's something that you can address in a bike fit.

Jake: But sometimes you've got to kind of, you've got to tinkle, tinker, tinkle. You've got to tinker with these things. You've got to take her with these things and you've got to try different saddles until you find the one that, that's the sweet home run for you. And for me personally, I know that I [00:45:00] went through quite a few in my early years and then until I finally found something, then I'm like, all right, that, that, that's the one there.

Jake: So, you know, try different things. And it's really cool now because there's a lot of really neat 3d printed saddles that really can like hold you much better. Yeah. You know, you don't have to get something that's like, that looks cool. Cool. And just deal with it and know that you're going to have issues with that down the road.

Jake: You can, you can find some stuff now that that's going to work really well, but it looks cool too. But the other thing is a lot of people you would be amazed that we deal with don't know what chamois cream is or don't know the value of a good bib and chamois. So those things, your saddle, your chamois and your chamois cream, get the, this, the, that magic little trifecta, figure it out.

Jake: Almost becomes moot. It's almost a nonpoint. I think, 

Ian: uh, also you just need to pedal harder. The more watts you put down, the less pressure you're putting down on the saddle, right? 

Lance: The leg pain overrides the taint pain. Yeah. 

Ian: Actually, there is some truth in that. If [00:46:00] you're a, if you are an absolute beginner cyclist and, you know, you, you have more pressure, Bearing down on there because often, often you've got your handlebars a little bit higher, so you're sitting more upright, you're putting less pressure through the legs, so you are.

Ian: There's more pressure on, on you, but yes, I, there is some truth to that, but 

Lance: I will say that very quickly I quit using budget shammies. I quit using cheap cycling shorts. I moved to, to much more expensive, but 

Jake: a good set of bibs is going to cost you 120 to 200 bucks. It just depends on what brand you're going with.

Ian: It's available now. I like, I mean, I remember back in the eighties and nineties, all you had was. Shammy was a shammy, was a, was a, a leather insert in your cycling shorts, really thin. And you needed a shammy cream and stuff to, to make it work. But now these days, you know, [00:47:00] as with everything, the equipment's gotten so much better.

Jake: But a good, good set of bibs with a good chamois and some chamois butter is going to really cut down on the saddle sores and the other abrasions that you're going to get in areas that, that you don't want to think about because it's just not fun. And sometimes you'll quickly learn what was abrased as soon as you jump in the shower and you scream bloody murder.

Jake: Yeah. You guys know what I'm talking about. 

Ian: It's also the same, same as with the over. Overuse injury, uh, topic is like, you really need to, if you're getting a saddle sore, you really need to take some time off the bike and let it heal, right? If, if at all possible, but we being obsessive cyclist types, we find that a difficult thing to do.

Ian: With the frickin Moleskine donut on it. But my FTP is going to drop by two watts. All that work I've been doing is gonna be out of the window. 

Lance: Do you put shammy cream on the shammy or on your bits? Both. I just put them on my bits. I 

Jake: put it on on the bits but I also put it on the part of the shammy where the bits touch where I generally have issues and [00:48:00] that that's rock solid for me.

Jake: I 

Ian: just reach down there and slather it. You hop too long on that thing? I use toothpaste. 

Jake: Oh, have you used the Eurostyle before? Something. You get that like, whoo hoo! It's got a little bit of that eucalyptus in it. No, I shouldn't. It's a very cooling effect, if you will. All right, let's move on to the next one.

Jake: This isn't really an issue for this time of year, but you know, we deal with this stuff every single summer, and it's going to be the air quality issues that we get. And a lot of times it's from like the forest fires. And then in general, you get, You know, just, if you're riding closer to a city or a major metropolitan area, you're going to be dealing with smogs and whatnot.

Jake: So, respiratory issues. 

Lance: Salt Lake Valley, uh, during the winter has terrible air quality. All of the smoke from the chimneys? It's not the smoke from the chimneys. It's like the valley, like, holds in the air and it gets like stagnant. So. Okay. But, and that's not during, that's not because of, because of wildfire smoke.

Lance: We have problems with air quality because of wildfire, wildfire smoke in the Pacific Northwest. But yeah, especially 

Ian: in central Oregon, this, the [00:49:00] last couple of years, like I met somebody on the plane, on the aircraft coming back from London a few weeks ago from, lived in Bend. And he said, I'm just, I'm ready to move because it's been three or four years, months on end of just 

Jake: smoke.

Jake: Yeah. It's terrible. And yeah. We've had a few times where the AQI was in the six and seven hundreds. Yeah. And we've had times where it was so smoky outside. You could barely see the sun. It was just that bad. It was like cloud cover, but like 

Ian: pictures of racing at PIR and the sky is orange. It's just, we shouldn't have been doing it again.

Jake: Just be smart. Use a good monitoring app. There's all the apps out there that you can read the AQI and it's really not, it's not worth it to go out and ride when it's in a moderate zone. I mean, If you absolutely have to go ahead, but maybe that's a good day to jump on the indoor trainer, even though it's summertime or whatever.

Ian: They actually, uh, did, I think it was last year, right? Obra, um, 

Lance: OBRA has a limit, 

Ian: has a, has a protocol now. Yeah. Uh, [00:50:00] set a set limit. 

Lance: Yeah. I can't remember what it is. Which makes a lot of sense. It's 140 or 150 or 130 or something like that. It's, it's pretty high. Enough where sensitive people shouldn't be racing anyway.

Ian: Yeah. But like, I mean, if I was a race promoter in Central Oregon, that, that'd be worrying. Like your whole, uh, event could be taken, taken down. There's happened. Quite a few. Quite a few. It's happened. 

Jake: Yeah. All right, let's move on. The next one, traumatic injuries. Traumatic injuries are my specialty. That's my forte.

Jake: That's my jam. What do you guys got to say about that, though? 

Lance: Um, generally, it's gonna happen at least once, so, um, and maybe sometimes more. Uh, what do you do with it? Yeah, you know, you just have to, you have to go through the process of getting back on the horse. You need to listen to your doctors, um, and get the healing process started.[00:51:00] 

Lance: The, the difficulty with that is oftentimes doctors are dealing with the general public and not athletes. That was going to be my point. Yeah. And so the general public's timeline is going to be different than what an athlete's timeline might be. And it's, if you can get your doctor to help them understand.

Lance: What you're actually trying to do physically and not just, yeah. So that's tricky. Jake, you got a lot more ideas about this than me. 

Jake: Uh, yeah, well, yeah, I've, I've, I've seen some things. I've done some things, but you know, the, the, the athlete's mentality is like, I can deal with the pain and suffering. My question to you, doctor is, is this something, if I'm going to do this whole riding in the bike thing sooner than your average person, is that going to cause me pain and discomfort?

Jake: Which I know inside that I can handle, because we'll go sit on a bike for hours on end and just completely obliterate ourselves. Or is this something that's gonna make things worse or slow down the injury healing process? If it's the latter, then I need to [00:52:00] listen to the doctor. If it's the former, I can deal with that.

Jake: And when I broke my hip, That was, that was my whole mantra with the doctor. And I was completely transparent with them. And Mike, listen, I will listen to you. I will do everything that you tell me to do. However, you need to know that I don't care about the pain. I just need to be able to get back on the bike.

Jake: I need to be able to get back to riding. Cause I've got things I want to accomplish. And he's like, Oh, you're one of those. And I kind of smiled like, yeah, kind of. And he told me, he's like, all right, not for nothing, but riding a bike is going to be your best friend. And this is when I broke my hip. I was, the femoral neck was broken.

Jake: I've got three titanium screws in there. And. He said that, you know, because we put those titanium screws in there, that pretty much that's the healing that your body needs. Now the bone still needs to fuse, but those, those, uh, screws that are in there are going to do what they need to do. It's, it's going to hold the bone in place.

Jake: He's like, I wouldn't recommend going over a certain threshold. And thankfully he knew about riding bikes. And I think it's probably because maybe he's ridden a bike or two in his day and probably knuckleheads that have been through on his surgery table. And he told me, he's like, listen, don't get out of the saddle, keep it under.

Jake: [00:53:00] I think he told me like 350 Watts or something like that. I'm like, all right, I can do that. And he's like, you need to listen to your body. You need to rest as necessary. And he's like, what are your plans? I'm like, well, and we're having this conversation. I think it was a week or eight, two weeks ago. 10 days post op or something like that.

Jake: He's like, right. You can start writing on an indoor trainer at 10 days out and just take it easy, work with a therapist. I'm like, right. When can I write outside? He's like, Oh God, I'm like, no, he's like, you could technically write outside at that point in time too, but give it a couple more days just to see how it feels and then try and do a ride outside.

Jake: All right. Got that. And he's like, what else do you got on plan? Well, You know, in three weeks, I'm doing this MS 150 thing and it's a hundred miles in the first day and 50 miles on the second day and I want to, you know, go out there and be able to do it because I've done it for many years and he's like, oh my gosh, it's like, again, just don't get out of the saddle, don't go over a certain watt threshold, listen to your body, I'm like, all right, I can do that.

Jake: So I went out, um, doing that. 14 days post op. And I've told the story before. So sorry for like telling it again, but I went out 14 days post op and did a 35 mile ride [00:54:00] outside. And then I did the MS one 53 weeks post op and did just fine. 

Lance: But 35 years old is different than 50 years old. Correct. Yeah. Yeah.

Jake: So 60, 63 years. So, and again, that's another thing that you have to factor in is like, You know, my brain still thinks I'm 25 years old. It really does. And even my 35 year old self thought I was maybe 15 or 16 years old. So it's always like chasing, but 

Ian: I got to say, I, I, it's my number one concern. I do live in fear of hurting myself badly.

Ian: And, and it sounds bad, but at my age, it, you know, a bad injury could possibly be the last time I,

Ian: I've only got one, thank goodness, like one permanent injury from, from riding this, that's this separated shoulder here and you know, it, it could have been so much worse, but even, even that is, I [00:55:00] wish I hadn't done it. It's 

Jake: it sucks. You know, when I broke my hip, it was, it hurt. It was a pain in the ass, but it, at the same time, I came out of it pretty well.

Jake: Pretty good. And I'd learned a lot about myself in terms of like, all right, if you put your mind to something and you really focus on this and, and you work with the medical professionals and you don't like push it too far, you can accomplish some pretty gracy things. And, and there was a lot of times where it was like, it was painful, but it wasn't hurting myself.

Jake: I wasn't making things worse. I just. Had the ability to kind of work through that. And it just kept progressing and getting better. And eventually it was like, oh, I didn't notice that at all today. That's fantastic. And then next thing you know, you're bouncing back. However, it was, what, three years ago now that I had another fall on that same exact tip that caused this whole, the other thing with my hip to kind of spiral out of control.

Jake: It was kind of the same thing, but. Yeah. These, these stupid injuries. And 

Ian: just the, the cruelty of it, it's the one, it's the thing you love to do the most and it's the one thing that's taken away from you because you're, you're injured, you know, all these years you've been [00:56:00] dealing with that and it has profound effects, right?

Jake: Yeah, but, and then getting hit by the car. That was the one that kind of, that one sucked. Anyway, it's for when you're riding bikes and I don't want to scare anybody, but if you're going to go ride bikes and you're going to do this whole bike thing and you're going to go all in, I mean, how many people do you know that.

Jake: Ride a lot who've never crashed. None. Exactly. It's not if, but when it's going to happen. And it's just like, just be smart about everything. It's gonna happen, you know, but learn how to crash. There's a, there's an art to that, you know, and, and put yourself in safe situations so you don't get hit by cars.

Jake: Ride certain routes. Don't ride at certain times of the day. I mean, you can. It's never going to be something that you can fully control, but you can make the odds more in your favor. Make them vote in your favor. So just be smart about it. Cool. All right. The next one, heart health risks, heart health risks.

Jake: Um, so like intense endurance training over time can lead to conditions like arterial fibrillation and cardiac issues. This is a real thing for cyclists. I [00:57:00] know a couple people 

Lance: that had that go into AFib if they, if they push a little bit too hard or in, or if their body is off for some reason, you can go into a fib and that's the end of your ride basically.

Lance: So there is some issues like that. Um, funny enough, cardiovascular issues is one of the reasons why I do this is trying to be cardiovascular Lee fit, but now I'm completely overdue. 

Jake: For this, I mean, I don't think we need to get into much on this and I don't think any of us have anything to say about this and knock on wood because normally I'll probably fall over dead from a heart attack next week, um, cause that's just my luck.

Jake: Um, the, the biggest thing, and this is one of the things for me, cause I've known about this as well, is like, make sure that you regularly schedule your annual physical, go in and see your doctor, get your blood work done, have them listen to your heart, have them do any kind of EKG testing. If you've got family history, you know, just get everything on the record and be regularly tested.

Jake: That's going to make a big difference for you. 

Ian: Um, educate me. Is it true though, [00:58:00] that if you're going to go into a fib, you know, through some sort of endurance exercise or stressing you out that much, is that a, is that something that you would happen to you anyway, is it, is it only, or can you Can you acquire that kind of, there is, there is a defect, there 

Jake: isn't a genetic undertone to some of that, but there's also the, um, the thickening of your ventricle wall can get too strong, too thickened.

Jake: And then you can create issues from that. I don't want to get too in depth in this cause I don't want to speak out of turn. Then this might be something we can talk about a little bit more at a later date, but just from my general knowledge, that's kind of some of the things that you can develop. But I think for the most part, a lot of this is going to be.

Jake: genetically driven that you might be predisposed to this and not necessarily know. But I do know and have heard some case studies of people that don't have the family history and then they have developed cardiac issues from this. So I mean, at the, 

Ian: at the extreme end, you have young athletes, you know, tragically dying through, [00:59:00] um, genetically, um, Defects in their, in their hearts and something that they would never have realized had they not become athletes, you know, that, that, that sort of vulnerability.

Ian: I always think if I, if I'm going to, if I'm going to kill over through, um, touch wood, if, if I'm going to kill over through some big cardiac event, it would have happened by now. They, you know, the, Pushing your heart rate up to over 200 in a big sprint or something. It's, you know, you're putting so much stress on that.

Ian: Yeah. I would like to think at least that, um. I'm relatively immune to that now, since, since I've put myself under that stress so many times. Right. 

Jake: Cool. All right, let's, let's move on the next one. Um, I have no issues in this department, so I have no concerns about this for me, but there are some people that maybe have this as something that might be an issue for them, but bone density loss.

Jake: I am not a small human being, and I do not have small [01:00:00] bones, and this is not something I'm worried about, so 

Lance: If you, if the, the whole of your exercise stuff is non impact, like you're only cycling, you're not doing anything with weights, or with kettlebells, or with walking, or with hiking, then yeah, you can have bone density issues, and you're prone to like Hip fractures.

Lance: Exactly. 

Jake: And it's just like, like a little old lady, you know, that just doesn't have any stress on her body. And then over the course of time, maybe she's got like, you know, low calcium and whatnot, and then next thing you get this, these brittle bones and things can break down. Um, there's a thing called Wolf's law.

Jake: Basically it's like. Your body, when it has a stress on it, it will like have an equal and opposite reaction to that. So kind of think of like a callus on your hand. So if you got constantly work with your hands over the course of time, your hand's going to build up calluses to battle that same constant, the same concept though, like if you overstress your muscle, it's going to have, you know, it's response and it's going to, you know, Lay down more, uh, muscle fibers and just get stronger.

Jake: The same thing happens with your bones. When you put a stress or a load on them, [01:01:00] it will respond to that by making it more dense through calcium deposits and such, so that it's going to be, you know, more better able to handle the stresses and the rigors that you put it through cyclists. Like sure, like maybe you're pedaling and maybe your, your, your feet and your ankles and your knees are, you know, getting a little bit of stress and overload.

Jake: But if you think about the fact that they're not really putting much stress on, like, you know, kind of like their lower back and their, their full back and they're just the rest of their upper body, you can, you can deal with this. This is a real thing. 

Ian: Even pedaling as much as we do this. There's really, even though you think, Oh, I'm putting down 300 Watts, you know, for an hour or whatever, you're actually not putting that much mechanical force on those bones compared with say, if you're in the gym doing, doing a set of squats or deadlifts, you'd be putting all that stress through your bones, um, through skeletal, uh, Skeleton as well as the muscles.

Ian: Sure. So you, you end up [01:02:00] between the joints and let's say between your elbow and your shoulder, if you're doing a bicep curl, um, that bone is, is slightly, um, deforming every time you do that. And that causes extra bone deposits to form. Sure. And so. Resistance training is, is the number one way to mitigate against 100 percent agrees.

Ian: And then speaking as an older athlete, it, it, this is one of those things that does become more important as you age, because it's natural that you're going to, your bone density goes down. As you get older, as you get into your senior years, as well as your natural, uh, muscle mass decreases. So it behooves you to do everything you can to sort of stem the stem, the deterioration.

Jake: Sure. 

Ian: Um, and as you get really old, you know, that the, You, [01:03:00] the risk of you falling and injuring yourself is gets huge. And so, um, yeah, increased bone density, increased muscle masses is everything. It becomes really important as you get all those 

Jake: weight bearing exercises as well, like running and hiking and like the strength training, like Ian said, it's going to be the big number one thing, but cross training, hiking, running the whole bit there, that's going to add those stresses on your body as well.

Jake: Which is I've tried 

Ian: to do more. So I. Realize, you know, I looked at my calorie expenditure and the things I've been doing and I realized, oh yeah, I do this killer bike ride. I'm out on my bike for two hours and I've, I've burned all this, um, energy and stuff, and then I didn't do much for the rest of the day.

Ian: So I'm trying to get out and walk and hike and do other things where I'm not just riding and that's it. 

Jake: One other form of cross training that I can recommend for roadies and maybe even some of the gravel guys to a certain degree, go ride a mountain bike. 

Lance: Yeah, 

Jake: because [01:04:00] you will be absolutely amazed how much you're going to be throwing that bike around and throwing yourself around and trying to get over stuff and pulling and pushing and doing all of the things.

Jake: Like if you, well, I'll just say me, if I haven't done a mountain bike ride in a long time and I've just been doing a lot of road, road, road, road. And I get back on the mountain bike and I go do a long mountain bike ride with a lot of like more technical stuff. It doesn't have to be crazy technical, just technical stuff in general.

Jake: I come home and I'm like, Good Lord, my shoulders and my triceps and my obliques and my back. Everything is just wrecked in a good way. But that's a good way to do a little bit of cross training. Plus you get the bike handling skills. 

Ian: Or even a friend of mine is into dirt bikes, um, motorcycle. And he comes back and he says, man, what a workout.

Ian: I'm like, really? You didn't, you didn't have to pedal. But, um, no, you're throwing 

Jake: that bike around a lot and you're just constantly like stressing yourself. So cool. All right, let's do two more of these and we'll be done. Um, this one. Again, not an issue today. Heat related issues. Um, you know, global temperatures are increasing.

Jake: It seems like it's getting hotter [01:05:00] in the summers for longer periods of times. And I'm not trying to be an alarmist or anything like that, but it is what it is. I mean, the, the, the temperatures are on the up and, you know, especially for us here, like in the Pacific Northwest, like we get used to riding in this crappy weather we have right now.

Jake: I don't know if we ever truly get used to it, but it's something that we kind of acclimate to. And then all of a sudden you get into the spring and it's, It's kind of nice. And all of a sudden we'll have these days where it hits like 90, 95, a hundred, 110 or whatever. And you want to go out and ride that.

Jake: We're not prepared for that at all. I'm not ready for that. And I feel like it's, the temperature is getting a little bit more extreme if you will, maybe a little bit higher, higher for a little bit longer periods of time and us being stupid cyclists. We want to go out and ride and it's nice. And maybe we can't get out first thing in the morning.

Jake: And then all of a sudden you're dealing with these heat exhaustion issues. You Lance have dealt with this when you were in Las Vegas. I'm 

Lance: prone to heat exhaustion. Yeah. Yep. 

Jake: So these are things that you got to be careful because they can, they can sneak up on you and they can be a big time problem if you're in the wrong place.

Lance: Uh, two, two things. My, my, my friends who live in Tucson or, you know, work and [01:06:00] train in Tucson, they ride at 5 AM, they ride early freaking early, and then the temperatures are manageable. This, the second thing is you have to hydrate enough. So either. You bring bottles and a hydration pack, or do you plan your routes where you can stop and refill bottles?

Lance: Because if, if you're doing a three hour ride and it's near a hundred degrees, you better, you're going to be going through six or seven bottles. You better plan to be able to refill those. Keep your electrolytes in check 

Jake: too. Yeah. So, you got anything to say about that? I got 

Ian: nothing to add to that. 

Jake: It is what it is, just be smart.

Jake: Uh, the last one. Vision and eye problems. You guys had any issues here? Do you guys have any issues, um, maybe today? 

Ian: Today my, my glasses were fogged up from the rain, and then, and I was still getting crap in my eyes, even with, even when I kept my riding glasses on, it's just uncomfortable. [01:07:00] But, um Apart from that, yeah, I've, I'm suffering from my, my vision is not what it used to be.

Ian: I do wear glasses all the time. I don't have a pair of, um, prescription cycling glasses. And so I just, I can never see what's on my computer. If I, some of the screens with, uh, I've just got three things on the screen, like my I usually look at power and heart rate and something else, cadence, whatever. I can just about make that out.

Ian: But if I'm trying to follow a map, trying to follow a route, 

Jake: it's 

Ian: done for. 

Jake: And if you take glasses off, you're going to get shell destroyed, especially if you're riding a group, you're behind everybody, but you know, it's just that time of year where if it's raining, there's so much debris in the road and things are going to flap and hit you in the eyes and it's just, you can't do it.

Jake: And then if you have them on and they get fogged up and, you know, raindrops everywhere and you can't see anything and then next thing you know you're hitting the crap on the road. Or you rode 

Lance: with these potholes. 

Ian: You didn't wear your glasses today, right Lance? 

Lance: My, my glasses stayed on my face for [01:08:00] about 20 minutes and I took them off and rode without them.

Lance: Three and a half hours I can do without glasses. Without glasses as long as stuff isn't but I was on the front the whole day Yeah, so I wasn't getting as much stuff in my face or in my eyes And so I could when I when I did get to a point where I was riding behind somebody I did put my glasses on just because otherwise you're hitting crap in the road 

Jake: Here's something that I want to try and I'm actually gonna be putting this stuff on my car You can actually see it on my desk right here.

Jake: Have you ever put rain X on your glasses before it doesn't work? 

Lance: Um, I've done it a couple times, and if you don't apply it properly, it leaves these swirls in your glasses that are, that are difficult to see through. Really? So you have to apply it right, and again, it only lasts for, like, if you're, if, if it's raining and the stuff isn't, if you're not going fast enough, it doesn't help.

Lance: Really? Yes, and then if you're wiping your glasses with your [01:09:00] gloves, You know, um, every time you wipe your glasses with your gloves, that only takes 20 or 30 times and that renex is gone. So, so yes, I have done it. I've been desperate enough to try it. I have, I have eye issues where, like, I can only see well for about six hours when I'm writing, whether I'm wearing glasses or not.

Lance: Eventually my vision starts to, uh, fuzz. Seriously. Yes. It's one of the reasons why I don't do longer races because I know my vision's gonna like die on me at some point and I, and I won't be able to see right. I've had some issues in some longer races where I just gutted it out and it got really, really dangerous for me.

Lance: Interesting. So I'm cautious about that. It's one of the reasons why I always choose shorter distance races when I go to these big national races because I know my vision is just not going to make it. So, um, Yeah, 

Jake: going 

Lance: back 

Jake: to the glasses thing, I want to try the next I'll report back to see if that works.

Jake: I have to actually write outside though. [01:10:00] That's the first challenge. But the other thing is, I've talked about this before. I will not ride without glasses if I if unless I absolutely have to take them off. Yeah. And I just took it off. One giant ass June bug thing that hit my eyeball once when I was like going 23 or four miles an hour and my whole eye went black for like a moment and then it like slowly came back and it did not feel good at all.

Jake: I'm like, I am never not wearing glasses again. If I, if I can help it and I've taken them off just. a very few sparing times. And it was mostly like, I don't know, I think it was maybe like a gravel ride. It was raining. It was like covered in sloppy mud and I couldn't see anything. And I was afraid I was going to hit a pothole or something like that.

Jake: I felt like it was better just to maybe slow down, just to go take the glasses off and be able to see what I am. I'll take mine 

Ian: off if I'm on a big, long climb. I'll just take them off and put them up in my house. Okay. That is an exception. Face is getting 

Jake: sweaty. Exactly. If it's going to start sweating and Fogging up your glasses.

Jake: I do take them off for that. Or yeah, you just, that's the worst too. You [01:11:00] get some nice clean glasses and I wear one of those, uh, cold cap halo things, it's got the little, um, silicone band and that thing will fill up with sweat and usually it will like wick off the back, but sometimes it'll get over full and like if your helmet touches it just right, it like you get the stream of sweat that comes down and you're like, 

Ian: yep.

Jake: Son of a bitch! You just wrecked my 

Lance: glasses. I do not ride a bike without a sweat strip, like, on my forehead. Because I, I, my glasses will not make it an hour and a half without that. It's true 

Ian: what Jake says, at some point it gets overwhelmed. 

Lance: Yeah. 

Ian: And then You're nice, clean glasses get all covered in sweat.

Ian: And that's usually 

Jake: done for most time. I can feel like a little drip will like seep down, like, Oh, it's, it's ready. So if I put my head over to the side and I push on the front of my helmet to, uh, at a position or an angle where it's not going to come down in my glasses, you'll get this like big stream of sweat that'll shoot.

Jake: I'm like, right now I've got another half an hour, 45 minutes before I have to worry about that again. But if you forget, you're screwed. Yeah. 

Ian: All right, well, 

Jake: that was 

Ian: fun. That's a good list. 

Jake: Anything else, boys? Nope. [01:12:00] Anything that we missed on that list? Yeah, there's hundreds of things. Let's leave them for another day.

Jake: Okay. One last thing. Matt LeGrand, you always go for, oh crap, it's not here. 

Lance: Uh, Matt LeGrand put out a video, uh, called 10 GPS watch trends for 2025. You put it out a couple of days ago. Um, if you want to see Matt's glorious face and great editing skills, you should go take a look at his. You watched it? I watched the first two minutes.

Jake: Oh, that sucks. Why didn't you watch the whole 

Lance: thing? I don't remember 

Jake: why you lost interest. . Scroll the whole thing. Scroll, yeah. Something. Aw, I I do wanna watch that 'cause I'm curious about that. Um, curious. I, I, I kind of dig the, the smartwatches. The garments are pretty sweet. So curious to see what might be coming down the pipeline.

Jake: Is there anything about your smartwatch that you have your. I got a 

Lance: brand new Phoenix 8 for Christmas, thanks to my wife and Jake, they kinda came through for me, thank you guys very much. What was the, what's your take away with the thing? The freakin AMOLED screen is beautiful. Fantastic. The [01:13:00] flashlight is, I don't know how I live my life without it.

Jake: I'm telling you, right? I use it. And when I say this, I'm not embellishing. I'm not like trying to oversell this thing because of the flashlight. I use that thing every single day and it is worth it 

Lance: so much. I love it. I used it today, Ian. Do you remember? We were in the sauna and I wanted to see what the temperature was and I couldn't read it and I flicked on the light and boom, it was 190 in there.

Lance: It was 

Jake: pretty slick, so. All right. That's one last thing. This is his video. Go watch it. YouTube. com for slash Imla. Is it Imla grand or Matt Legrand? And it's Imla grand, right? It's Imla grand. Yeah. Yeah. Cool. Thanks Matt. Gibbo. One last thing. 

Ian: Um, we are just getting started on the initial preparation for our annual event.

Ian: Time Trial Extravaganza. Oh yeah! Yeah, the Michael Myers Memorial Time Trial, 4th edition. I can't remember. I think so, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um, Sunday, March the 9th. Yep. So, we've got a [01:14:00] flyer out, published, I think. Um, I'm working on permits. Um, 

Jake: It's on the Obra calendar too, yeah? 

Ian: It's on the Obra calendar already.

Ian: It's gonna be out at Vancouver Lake. It's 12. 7 kilometers, 20 miles. Uh, uh. 12 miles. 12 miles. Yeah, 

Jake: 12. 2 or 8 or something. 20 kilometers. Sure. So it's kind 

Ian: of the big showcase thing for our, our team, for the Dialed, it's our big event of the year. Yeah, it's fun 

Jake: too because it kicks off the season. Yeah. 

Ian: So really reaching out to everybody that's on the Dialed Cycling Team, if you, we would love to see you out there.

Ian: pinning on a number, racing. And if you're not able to do that, um, there's going to be some links posted on our Slack channel and other places where you can volunteer and help out. So really would like to see a lot of involvement from, from the local community and the Dialed family. Sweet. Yeah. 

Lance: Looking forward to that.

Lance: Thanks. Hepler. One last thing. I kind [01:15:00] of liked it. I, I, that Matt was my one last thing. 

Ian: You 

Lance: cop out. Well, I got nothing else. I'm going to try to do this daily vlog thing. And, uh, 

Ian: You're going to Tenerife. You're going to do some races in Arizona, right? 

Lance: Yeah. When do you guys leave for Tenerife? We live in three weeks.

Lance: Okay. So it's still a few weeks out. It's still a few weeks out. I was 

Jake: wondering, I was like, is that like next week? But we've still got a few more weeks so you can get jackals. Yeah, 

Lance: three weeks and then we'll be back. And then I'm going right to Arizona. I'll be there for a month. Ian and I are going to do the Valley of the Sun stage race.

Lance: We're going to do the Tucson Bicycling Classic stage race. We're doing two road stage races while we're down there before training camp starts. So that's kind of the soft plan. 

Jake: Sweet. 

Lance: Yeah. 

Jake: All right. That's so fun. Um, I really don't have one last thing either, other than I'm just going to be slowly clawing my way back and getting back to riding and trying to find some fitness and yeah, that's pretty much it.

Jake: Oh, one other thing too. Um, the dialed cycling lab, we're going to be moving. We're moving. We're moving. We're moving. We 

Lance: are moving. [01:16:00] 

Jake: We're not moving very far. Moving into the suite next door. We're 

Lance: moving next door. Yeah. It's, 

Jake: um, we're, gosh, what, 1, 500 square feet? Not a big space, but when we first moved in there, I'm like, oh, this is perfect.

Jake: This is perfect. Big and spacious and roomy. And we've got some cool place to do the, the podcast and make videos and have an office space and place. And yeah, it's too small. 

Lance: We 

Jake: barely made it through this past summer. It was absolutely bonkers in there. And we almost moved this time last year, but like, yeah, let's just hold off for one more year.

Jake: And yeah, we're moving now because we, um, we ran out of space. So we're out of space. That said, um, I I'm hoping fingers crossed. We should start our tenant improvements here sometimes a month, which is kind of cool. And then we'll be hopefully starting to move in probably late February, March, somewhere in there, like slowly, but surely moving in there.

Jake: But what's really nice is like when you move. having to move less stuff is always cool. So stay tuned for some cool discount codes that you can use on the website so that we can lighten our load and have less crap [01:17:00] to move over to the new suite. And hopefully we can take care of some of our listeners and give them some cool discounts on a bunch of cool things.

Jake: So, 

Ian: so are you moving into next door instead of, or as well as the current location? Kind of a little bit of both that remains 

Lance: to be seen. Yeah, that isn't fully Yeah, 

Jake: there we will have first writer will few of refusal on the current space that we're in And then we also have the ability to take a section of it because I think that where we're moving into is a good space But I just want to kind of future proof things just a little bit more, but there's also one harebrained cockaminy pipe dream, crack pipe dream thing that I have in the back of my head that I've shared with Lance.

Jake: I don't want to get into it right now, but I'm kind of working on a little business plan that I like this idea. Yeah. That might pan out, might work. And it would be really cool thing for, for our team, for the lab, for the community, for kids, for people in general, if it works out, it'd be fun. So stay tuned.

Jake: Cool. All right. That's it. I'm done out. You're out. I'm out. Ian, you're out. I'm out. Yeah. Cool. All right. [01:18:00] We will be back next week with another one of these. And until then, bye for now.